Did Prop 8 Pass? California Prop 8 Results
Did Prop 8 Pass? Here are the latest California Prop 8 Election Results. As of 11 pm PST, Prop 8 numbers are the following.
53% voting in favor of prop 8
47% voting against prop 8
The numbers are courtesy of KNBC Los Angeles reporting only 33% of election results currently in. The website as of 11 PM Los Angeles time here does not state when the results are last updated on their website. However KNBC reported the same margain numbers within the half hour on TV.
Prop 12 and Prop 7 are projected passing by KNBC with approx 65/33% margains with, again, 33% of polls reporting.
*** LIVE UPDATE: 12 midnight ***
As of midnight here in Los Angeles, here is the latest update. On Prop 8, KNBC is reporting the same numbers as one hour ago when this LALATE story was written, now with more votes in.
11 pm PST (KNBC):
53% voting in favor of prop 8
47% voting against prop 8
33% ballots counted
12 midnight PST (KNBC):
53% voting in favor of prop 8
47% voting against prop 8
49% ballouts counted
*** LIVE UPDATE #2: 7:30 AM ***
As of 7:30 am here in Los Angeles, here is the latest update. On Prop 8, KNBC is reporting the following numbers.
7:30 am PST (KNBC):
52% voting in favor of prop 8
48% voting against prop 8
95% ballots counted
Why??
KNBC does not have a live widget to see incoming results. So for updates throughout the night on Prop 8, go here . On the left toolbar, pull down to the Proposition Section.
Post your thoughts.
*** LIVE UPDATE #3: 8:30 AM ***
As of 8:30 am here in Los Angeles, local broadcast TV is reporting over 4 million absentee ballots are not yet counted, placing this proposition still up in the air.
*** LIVE UPDATE #4: 12 NOON ***
A Proposition 8 Protest Rally 11/5/08 7 pm
A major proposition 8 protest rally has just been announced for tonight, 7 pm. For the details just breaking, click here:
http://news.lalate.com/2008/11/05/proposition-8-protest-rally/.
on November 5th, 2008 at 3:59 am
so…. at least 50% of California is intolerant. Wonderful….
on November 5th, 2008 at 4:57 am
And over 50% of Californians believe that they deserve more rights than other…that’s great.
Well Yes on 8 got their way…maybe next they will make gays drink from different fountains and sit in the back of the bus!
This is disgusting! Intolerance and hatred won this battle. Way to teach your children to hate anything different than your own little world.
on November 5th, 2008 at 7:21 am
Why is it that you are the one trying to change what I hold sacred, yet I am the intolerant one? What you want is what I have. If you get it, then I don’t get to have it anymore. You need rights, I agree. I am totally in favor of that, but why take mine to get yours? Fight for your own values. Don’t try to take mine away.
on November 5th, 2008 at 7:43 am
How does giving me the right to marry take that right away from you?! Is it that hard to think that we may share common values? It is intolerant to take that right, and that validation, away from thousands of families, none of whom are infringing upon your right to live your life as you please. I just do not understand you people.
on November 5th, 2008 at 8:14 am
5:11am 91% counted Yes 52% No 48%
this is such crap they so scewed the result by lying about it being about teaching it in schools
on November 5th, 2008 at 8:18 am
banning gay marriage is an act of hatress. not love. and the teaching of Jesus are all about love and compassion. if people is so protective of their religious believes, why don’t they declare war against divorce? it is clear in the Bible that divorce is wrong. but nobody complains about it. Instead, they try to keep marriage away from people who loves each other… because marriage is the sacred union between a woman and whoever wins a reality show. or between two teenagers who have to rush it to the altar before the baby pops out. this is just a step back, but not the end of it… Gay marriage is going to happen, sooner or later. just look at what is happening around the world. you people can not stop it.
on November 5th, 2008 at 8:21 am
I just stumbled upon this while trying to find results. I think this is horrible. I had thought California residents would not pass this shitty deal. But, all the ones who think that we are trying to take something sacred from them decided otherwise. Half of California sucks balls right now (not in the literal sense). I live in Nebraska and I was hoping for a great outcome. This is very sad.
on November 5th, 2008 at 8:36 am
I’m extremely dissapointed by this. I had been a California resident all my life until this past summer, when I moved to Oklahoma. It’s a sad day in our country when not only are people descriminated against, but that there are enough sheep-minded intolerant people in what I thought to be the most progressive state in the US.
on November 5th, 2008 at 8:37 am
@Kurt
If Prop 8 failed, I guarantee you, your life would continue exactly as it has been. In no way whatsoever would a single thing be taken away from you. If you value the “sacredness” of your marriage, then celebrate it by living your life and honoring your marriage with virtue. Don’t desecrate it by making it a tool of hate and discrimination.
By the way, gay marriage is legal in other states in the union already, as well as around the world. If the simple fact of it being allowed somehow makes straight marriage less sacred, then I hate to tell you but you are way too late. Somewhere in the world, gay marriage will be allowed and nothing will turn back that clock.
on November 5th, 2008 at 9:18 am
what “you” hold sacred.. and what should be the “sanctity” of marriage.. didnt they teach you in school church and state are seperate?
stop trying to impose your religious views to the masses and think about equality amongst mankind
on November 5th, 2008 at 9:27 am
Kurt:
How will a gay couple marrying change or take away your rights in any way, shape, or form? How will 2 gay people hurt your marriage to your wife? What right do you have that is being challenged? “All you hold sacred?” Please. I am a straight, engaged female and I fail to see how Steve and Jason getting married next door will hurt or help my engagement in any way.
Listen. If you guys want to make marriage sacred, why don’t you guys stop desecrating it by, oh, I don’t know: letting celebrities get married for 48 hours. Or putting up reality TV shows that claim “Who Wants To Marry a Millionaire” or “Who Wants To Marry a Midget” or “Joe Millionaire” or “My Big Fat Obnoxious Fiance” or all those other stupid marriage/dating reality shows. The way I see it, seems to me that STRAIGHT people have been the ones ruining the sanctity of marriage. We have lovely and beautiful privilege we and abuse it and take it for granted.
Marriage is about loving someone and promising and devoting the rest of your life to them, male or female. If my boyfriend and I broke up and I fell in love with a woman, I’d want every right to be able to marry her, just as I can marry a man today.
on November 5th, 2008 at 9:37 am
You all can have your opinions and now you are upset that others who have a diffeent opinion…who’s being hateful. Maybe a bit of “sore loser” coming out in you. Any amount of research in what happened a while back when the MAJORITY of Claifornians, over 4 million people, voted against this already, and our time was wasted yet again to confirm that vote. No one is tryingto hate anyone that is gay. Just go ahead and have your opinions, but don’t bitch when your outvoted. Just get off your butt and help spread your word so next time your vote wins. Its called democracy and you just happened to be outvoted by people with virtues. Don’t start waiving the “Christ loves everyone” card. Last time I checked it was “Love the sinner, hate teh sin.” When will you people stop trying to impose YOUR will to want ot see homosexuality as normal? Its not normal you idiots! Its a predisposition, or tendancy that is wrong. You don;t see me going out and trying to hup my neighbors wife just because i think she is hot and I want to get with her and just because I “have those feelings” that is is right. We all have feelings and tendencies that are not right. Holy crap, learn a little about control….and try to draw a line in teh sand somewhere. You people stand for absolutely NOTHING!
on November 5th, 2008 at 9:38 am
Does anyone else see that the California constitution says that a ban on same sex marriage is discriminatory. And isn’t prop 8 discriminating against men and women that want to marry whoever they please? Why is this even possible. Ignorance is really bliss, religion is supposed to be separate from state so why are we allowing direct influence form religion that not everyone follows or believes frame our society. Fact: 50% of marriages are not religious ceremonies!!
on November 5th, 2008 at 9:43 am
I just want to make a statement of how proud I am of California right now. People voted for what they feel is right, even with accusations of making decisions based on hatred. Marriage is indeed a sacred union between one man and one woman. I am from Arkansas but I think I have gained a little faith in the rest of America today. This is truly great to see!
on November 5th, 2008 at 9:45 am
D,
Wow you are really one of the most closed minded person’s I have ever met. All of what you said above was based on your common, religious-based biased belief!! Ooh, if I wasn’t such a lady I’d be making you eat a dick. Now lets be civilized and understand that this is only oppression of what is different, what is not your cup of tea.So because you find some book that is supposed to be holy, and it has a lot of good stories and morals in it, that everything in it is un-biased and correct? In your mind it isn’t “hating”, oh but yes it is!! I know what it is, you don’t want to see change! I bet you voted for McCain didn’t you? Tisk, tisk. Boy you people have a lot of growing up to do! Btw it is wrong to impose any of your beliefs on the next, I’m not imposing shit on you by marrying another woman, I’m doing what the fuck I please in my own manner!!
on November 5th, 2008 at 10:11 am
I love how all the YesOn8 people start off by pontificating on who’s intolerant and who’s got sour grapes from the soap box…then summarily descend in to madness, spouting crap about state unions that happen to be called ‘marriage’ being somehow taken away from them if Prop 8 fails, or that somehow the homosexuals who want to get _married_ are indiscriminate sodomites (why would they want to get married, then?).
You want to talk about the sanctity of marriage, let’s talk about John McCain’s marriage[s]. Or, ah, is that a sore subject?
on November 5th, 2008 at 10:14 am
Please try to follow my logic if you can…Is marriage a legal or religious institution? In a country founded on the seperation of Church and State, it can’t be both. If I get a marriage license and never go to church, it’s legally binding. If I get married in a church and never go to the courthouse, it’s not legal. Therefore, why can’t we require a civil union (the legal part) for everyone, gay AND straight and if you want to run to the church and have a big ceremony, let the church decided if they want to give you a Marriage Certificate which is not binding except in the eyes of the church. As long as we define marriage as a legal and religious contract/agreement we can NEVER acheive equality so let’s change the definition of marriage to be a religious institute and leave the legal issues to civil unions. Does that make sense to anyone because it seems quite clear and logical to me!
on November 5th, 2008 at 10:18 am
So sad for the state of California and the nation. It will only be a matter of time before gay marriage is legal. I was really hoping that California would make a step in the right direction and vote for equality. Just when I thought our country was making progress… I had no idea that one of the greatest and most diverse states is filled with so much hatred and people that have a sense of such entitlement to feel that they should take this right away. Equality is not a privlege.
on November 5th, 2008 at 10:22 am
Kurt and D, go on believing in narrow mindednes, believe in your bible, in denying others privilegdes you think you deserve. Why? What makes you better? intolerance and greed! If you still believe in the exact wording of the bible, you’d stone people who told you the earth was round? Your wonderful country would not even have been discovered . . .
I’m not deying your right to marry, nor your right to divorce, where’s that in the bible? In my opinion everybody has the right to make the same mistakes.
on November 5th, 2008 at 10:34 am
You know, there was also a time that the popular opinion of “marriage” was something between a man and woman of the same race, and anything else was wrong. Looking back at that now, don’t you think that’s discriminatory? Separation of church and state has been beaten to death, but it’s true… those who voted based solely on their religious beliefs, thanks a lot for making California look bad… it’s 2008, this shouldn’t be an issue!!
on November 5th, 2008 at 10:35 am
Less rights Less Taxes
on November 5th, 2008 at 10:38 am
Once again the “Moral Majority” acts out with intolerance. Hitler would have voted for prop 8, and prop 9 against blacks, 10 for Jews, 11 for Catholics, and against 12 because its what affected him. If you voted for 8, you’re a fucking biggot!
on November 5th, 2008 at 10:46 am
Marriage is a religious institution. It ALWAYS was, and ALWAYS will be. It doesn’t matter if you’re Muslim, Jew, Christian, WHATEVER, it doesn’t matter because all of those religions denote homosexuality as a sin, therefore, even if a homosexual is “religious”, they are going against that sanctity of marriage even in their own religion. So trying to make it a secular institution is wrong. Someone said something about divorce being against “Christianity” (when in fact, not just Christianity, most religions), well you’re right. Divorce is a secular being as well. So don’t you dare try and make me feel bad for doing what I feel is moral. Because I won’t feel bad. Spare the “separation of church and state” speech, because you are HIGHLY mistaken of this phrases place in history.
By all means, be gay. I really don’t care. However, when you start pushing your morals into my life, there will be resistance. I would expect you to feel the same way if someone tried to push their morals into your life. I would understand.
on November 5th, 2008 at 10:48 am
D… your speach is full of hate. and offenses. you are ignorant. and i pitty you.
on November 5th, 2008 at 10:53 am
… and to Brian “Those of you who voted on your religious beliefs…”
Of course I’m voting on my beliefs. I cannot and will not vote for my beliefs AND your beliefs. That’s what you SHOULD vote on. I don’t hate anyone who voted for Obama, or No On 8. I really don’t. I was against Obama in the election, but that doesn’t mean I can’t be for him as our president. I think Ron Paul would have been awesome, however, I hope that Obama can do a good job.
It escapes my memory who said this, and forgive the butchering of this quote, as it is more of a paraphrase:
“Politics have become nothing more than a sports game, where people sit in the stands and root for ‘their team’ regardless of what ‘their team’ is doing wrong.”
on November 5th, 2008 at 10:53 am
I am glad prop 8 will pass.
Marriage is between a man and a woman. They create a family by giving birth to a kid. A gay couple can not. This is not discriminating, it’s a fact. You can adopt but it is never the same as giving birth to a kid of your own. I am totally fine with people liking the same sex, but they are pushing it too far. I understand that sometimes being gay is not a choice, but teaching young kids that it is okay to like the same sex is wrong and disturbing.
on November 5th, 2008 at 11:00 am
Carlos - Your speech is full of grammical errors
Look, I don’t expect anyone to agree with me, but it’s my point of view, and I vote based on MY views. I respect the fact that other people have a different way of life. The problem is, I don’t agree with that, so I’ll vote against it. I don’t HATE gay people. I don’t HATE people who do other things I disagree with. When it comes down to it, I will vote in favor of my views.
Here it is, plain and simple:
I think marriage should be between a man and a woman.
If you think otherwise? GREAT! Just don’t get mad at me for having my opinion, man.
Whatever, I don’t think I can get anyone to see my view, so I’m wasting keystrokes.
on November 5th, 2008 at 11:02 am
Lili, it’s not a question of your beliefs. It’s a question of your beliefs being imposed on other people. I’m straight and married. Besides, no law defines marriage as between a man and a woman. Prop 8 proposes to add that definition to the constitution.
In 1920 voting was defined as something only a man could do. We fixed that then, I guess it’s going to take awhile before people are enlightened enough to give gays equal rights.
on November 5th, 2008 at 11:16 am
starsarebent - don’t forget the whole concept of marriage has changed through the years. poligamy was accepted in the old testament. arranged marriages in some religions are still accepted. today we understand marriage in a different way, and trust me, nobody wants to impose their believes on you or anyone else. gay people just want to get married because they love their partners. and they can not do it because, for some reason, it upsets you. don’t you see the problem here?
on November 5th, 2008 at 11:18 am
I’m thrilled to see such a wonderful outcome! I’m so happy my children will not learn things such as gay marriage being “ok” in school. I’m thrilled that so many people have morals, and used there right to go and vote for prop. 8!!!! thank you citizens of California!!!! You have made me proud to live here.
on November 5th, 2008 at 11:24 am
I can’t believe people think it’s “American” to take AWAY someone’s rights. If this thing passes it will be the FIRST TIME in American history we have actually TAKEN AWAY rights of people. That’s like telling a black person they can’t marry a white person. It’s just WRONG.
It’s not like we’re forcing it down your throat. as if you HAVE to life it. That’s just Crap. We just want to give gays the SAME RIGHTS as EVERYONE ELSE. is that so hard?
And besides, if you and your Church is against it, you can just tell them they can’t get married there; as if they’d want to marry around someone like you anyway.
We’re not taking away ANYONE’S rights, we’re being AMERICAN and GIVING rights to a group of people who ARE NOT GOING ANYWHERE EVER.
I’m not doing this for myself, I’m straight. I’m doing this for my family members who are gay and all my gay friends. AND all the gays out there.
This is Discrimination! This is totally unamerican.
Don’t teach your kids discrimination, teach them acceptance!!
on November 5th, 2008 at 11:26 am
Wow. Just wow.
California has been such a leading example of what can happen when civil rights are finally granted to one of the last unprotected targets of discrimination: gays. Here in Connecticut yesterday, we handily defeated a ballot measure that would have called for a constitutional convention to outlaw gay marriage in our state constitution. It’s here to stay in Connecticut - so for those 10-12 thousand folks whose marriages are about to be declared illegal in California, come on down to Connecticut or Massachusetts, where the “sanctity of marriage” belongs to everybody. Finally.
I can’t believe it, still - since when were rights something we could vote on? I bet if the Prop 8 mentality had been around longer, we would’ve just voted to not grant rights to slaves. We might have also just voted against the Civil Rights movement. Oh, and why bother with a Constitutional Amendment to allow women to vote, when we can just let the American people decide how best to apply equality?
To those who say that the courts “legislate from the bench” by applying equal rights to all, I say this: it is the court that has always been the last refuge of the minority against the tyranny of the majority. To simply overrule that protection - by, of all things, a narrowly-decided popular vote - is to ignore the most important task of the judicial branch of our government. A vote to decide whether rights should apply to all? Martin Luther King Jr. would be ashamed. Most importantly, it is the protection of religious practice that has so often been protected by the courts, especially in the last century. I shouldn’t need to remind those Mormons that supported Prop 8 that it was a series of court decisions, much like the one that granted gays the right to marry in California, that kept them from being legislated out of existence in the 20th century - despite a majority of people that would have voted to deny Mormons any rights at all. And here they are championing the cause of bigotry. We really have come full circle, haven’t we?
I’m married here in Connecticut. I’m a man and I married a woman. My marriage is NOT threatened by gay marriage, anywhere, anytime, anyhow. The “sanctity” of my marriage is not lessened by being shared. In fact, it is enhanced by finally being an institution open to all, instead of just some special privileged club, as these Yes On 8 voters would have it. Come on up, see the fall foliage, and enjoy a culture that has embraced equal rights. But for those of you that voted Yes on Prop 8 - shame on you. You are a throwback to a darker era, a time of ugliness and bigotry that is better off left on the scrap heap of history. I look forward to outliving your discrimination and seeing this nation move toward freedom.
on November 5th, 2008 at 11:29 am
Wh’at next, wanting to marry your dog, cat or donkey? Marriage has always been between a man and woman. This is not hatred, gays already have all the rights as straight people. We just want to keep marraige between a man and women sacred. The intolerate ones are the people who can’t have it their way and try to impose their beliefs on mine and indoctrine our children the gay lifestyle without the parents consent, as what happened in San Fran. SO IN REALITY THE GAYS ARE THE ONES THAT HATE. I love you and will keep you in my prayers.
on November 5th, 2008 at 11:31 am
Carlos-
Totally. I totally see the problem. However, you must understand, it does not upset me. I have gay friends (I know a common thing to say from a straight guy who’s married.) So I see what it’s all about. Marriage is taken lightly so much these days, it’s easy to get lost.
Let me take a break and say this; I don’t know why ANYONE would want to get married in the first place, lol.
Being gay goes against my PERSONAL morals. I feel that it is a sin.(Now I’m not claiming to be free of sin myself. Keep that in mind.) So I will vote (as stated before) for MY morals. If a group of people find it morally wrong to do something that I am doing, I would expect the same reaction from them.
For instance, let’s say I live in Las Vegas where it’s ok to gamble. If a group of people came out and said, “Hey, that goes against my morals, and I want to share my morals with, and protect MY children from having to live with that.” I would be upset that I cannot gamble, but I would understand that this is a touchy subject with many people, and for them to vote on morals is perfectly acceptable.
Would you hate me as a person because I want to gamble? Probably not, Carlos. Just as I do not hate anyone who is gay.
on November 5th, 2008 at 11:34 am
Thank you CA for voting your beliefs. In a democracy the majority wins. I am thankful that the majority agrees that marriage should remain what it was meant to be. Gay people, find another term for it.
on November 5th, 2008 at 11:47 am
I just wanna know how gay marriage will affect people’s famillies. How does it affect you? There’s gay men and women all around you, it’s shown on TV in movies and out on the streets. I’m 16 and currently in High School. Teachers talk a lot about prop 8 and how their against it. It’s pure hate. Not one kid cares if gay marriage is passed. Maybe whats corrupting our world is the older generations of our current time. I can’t wait until my generation grows up and were all allowed to vote and voice our opinions without getting belittled. Oh, and about the school thing. Everyone knows that when you learn about marriage and sex ed. They send a waiver home before teaching starts. So that’s is such a mean way to use children as an excuse. Plus, theres so many gay people in high school, Kids are bound to find out one way or another. I though religion was about love and happines and faith? Guess that’s thrown out the window. Christian people are so hypocritical these days. The reason why the pilgrims came to the us was to practice christianity and be free. I guess america is not like that anymore
on November 5th, 2008 at 11:53 am
people don’t WANT to be gay. i tried not to be. it took me time to accept myself, because people kept telling me it was a SIN. For me,it was never a choice. I truly believe that the world is changing and gay marriage is an innevitability. it is going to happen. it is popping all over the world. slowly, but it will happen.
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:00 pm
All I have to say is Prop 8 passes “Whether you like it or not!” Thanks Gavin you made it an easy decision for me…
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:03 pm
I writing this comment this morning with mixed feelings. I’m at peace knowing California made the right choice, and pained to think many dear friends are gravely disappointed. What they saw as a chance for “happiness” and “equality” was yanked from them by a majority who seems to be intolerant and hateful. I am truly sorry for the hurt they are feeling.
I am personally against gay marriage because of the bigger picture. You may ask, “Don’t you want gays to be happy? Don’t you want equality? Don’t you want justice?” Yes! I want all of those. I want those things for Americans today and forever. Devastation will inevitably come to civilizations that embrace immoral behaviors. One hundred years ago the idea of this debate would have been appalling and ridiculous. If we choose to desecrate marriages in this way now, what will we accept in one hundred years in the name of “equality?” I’m well aware that there are some who already desecrate marriage in their own ways. By saying gays shouldn’t be allowed to marry isn’t saying I side with those who choose to treat marriage lightly. I’m standing up for marriage as it should be. Allowing homosexual marriages would just be another step down the wrong path. A path that would inevitably open the door to greater pain and devastation for society at large.
My opponents on this issue often cite examples of how marriage is already being flushed down the toilet. Since it’s already no big deal in the minds of so many, just let everybody do what they want, right? Wrong! If marriage were truly no big deal, we wouldn’t be having this argument. Homosexuals can see the beauty and sacred nature of marriage and long to have it in their lives. They see how important it is but what they don’t understand is that God’s sanctification is part of the package. Whether they have the stamp of legality or not, their relationships will never be the same as it is todaya marriage between a man and a woman because they will not have God’s blessing.
If two people want visitation rights that’s fine. If they want recognition for their relationship and commitment, they can have it. No argument, amendment, or proposition will ever change the divine purpose and qualifications for marriage. Mark my words and the majority’s vote: No society will ever thrive if they choose to shun the divine qualifications for marriage.
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:08 pm
Get over it, everyone. What a bunch of babies. If you want to be together, then BE TOGETHER. Nobody is stopping you. Make love, adopt if you must, go on vacations, buy a house together, whatever! Many of us think it is very disgusting. Let us have that right!!! Stop throwing your perverted ideals in our faces and just go to bed already!
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:09 pm
So murder is all around me, in TV shows etc, it does not mean that is ok. Just because someone believes something is right, IS IT? What makes something OK, what gives a person their moral values?
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:14 pm
May all of us live in peace, open-heartedness, and with compassion. May we all enjoy the freedom to live our lives with happiness and freedom.
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:15 pm
RK- You’re wrong. Gays do not have all the same rights straights have- hence the need for equal marriage rights. And that line about marrying a dog, etc.. is insulting to gay people and to straight people alike.
starsarebent- lumping gay rights with the right to gamble is ridiculous. One is not being discriminated against if one can’t gamble. Sheesh. Are you serious?
And Mike- This issue will not go away until full equal marriage rights are the law of the land all across this country. Equality will happen. Ever hear of the “tyranny of the majority” or the Bill of Rights? In other words, the majority should never have the right to take a minority’s rights away. That’s the American way.
I am heartened that there are still 4 million ballots out there to be counted. Do not lose faith everyone, it ain’t over yet! Regardless of the outcome, equal marriage rights are coming. Equality and truth will always win out over bigotry and lies in the end. It’s just a matter of time.
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:17 pm
i don’t mind if you want to be gay or lesbian that is your choice. the problem is that gay people want to recognized as another ethnic group when in fact if you are white, black asian, whatever you can be gay. being gay is nothing but a sexual preference that should be kept in the privacy of your bedroom. I DON’T WANT MY CHILDREN TO BE TAUGHT ABOUT BEING GAY. because even though you gay people say that it won’t be taught in schools it will happen. you want to recruit children into your lifestyle. children do not need to be exposed to your lifestyle. if children as they progress into growth and lives happen to embrace being gay then let it come naturally to them; not influenced.
ultimately being gay is not something that we are born with. none of the gay scientists that tried to prove this fact were ever proven right. being gay is a choice just like it would be for anyone that wants to sleep around with anyone whether they are man or woman.
i’m simply tired of gays parading practically naked down during the gay pride parade in front of children. being gay is about being attracted to someone of the same sex. kids are kids who do not need to know about sex until they mature into it.
either way i voted to ban gay marriage because it is the right thing to do. the other reasone is because if gays want special protection because they are gay and want to censor what is taught in churches. gays want to be recognized politically and that is shameful. keep your bedroom practices out of politics.
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:18 pm
The vast majority of people don’t understatnd the fundamental issues. They have been lead to believe that gays are attacking them. People in general don’t understand that gay couples get hit with inhereted taxes during Last Will provisions and That as we live shoulder to shoulder maintaining households paying our share of property taxes etc, and contribute to the community at large. The State has no obligation to those gay households. We have alloud the blurr and shock of the church to project this into a issue of religion…It should never been there to begin with…It’s not about the gays comming to a church where they arent welcomed to distroy your perfect marriages. It’s about bearing your brothers burdens. We have alloud the Christians to hyjack the issue and turn it into a religious battle…We say seperation of church and state but it is always easy to get simple minded christians swayed and move away from the real issues below the surface…My God loves you and I, even if Your God does’nt love Me, Amen
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:19 pm
Everyone has someone in their family that is gay, and believe it or not those family members deserve to be loved and respected by you. Everyone has their right to their beliefs but at the same time love should not have limitations. Have you ever tried to control love? Have you ever had someone say to you, you can not love that person. If you have, you still loved that person. People should have the right to love who they love no matter what kind of gentailia their body accommodates after all love radiates from heart to heart not from the inside out, not the outside in. People loving people should have the same rights no matter the gender. God loves everyone, He doesn’t love just straight people that love and marry. Seems as though people pick out what they want to from the bible to feed their own hatred against gays or people that are different from them. The bible also says judge not or you shall be judged. How would not supporting gay marriage take anything away from you? How would not supporting a family member that you claim to love that is gay be loving them and wanting their happiness? How dare you want the control over someone elses happiness. Maybe people like you need to look inside and see how much you really love yourself.
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:25 pm
Wayne- I was using that as an example did not mean to offend anyone. All I was saying is where does it stop? Other groups will want this so called “equality” also. where is my rights if I do not want the gay marriage. You believe in gay marriage, I do not, what makes you right and me wrong? I do not hate gays. I think that some things should be left along because one’s own faith and not be called a biggot, a hate mongle or what ever else you may label people who don’t agree with you. From my view I say you are the hateful people.
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:26 pm
Shannon it would change everything if gay hasthe right please take a moment and think. The bible saids it is wrong also pasters will have to married them they want to be married in their church a paster will not have a choice if they turn them down some like that cam sue the chruch saying their are rases. Also read how a guy is sueng the bible because it has caused him mentail destress because he is gay. Not only that ok people will not be able to live confortable when he schools will be pushing this on our children. I feel those wantto be gay be gay but please don”t push i down our throut. Married is between man and a women and god saids in his word. Let me tell you they have more rights the a person who disablities they canget jobs hey a disblities person it is hard to get a job trust me. I have a friend who is disabled and she would her husband would love to adopted but her city wont let her.
Talk about change if no passes
I agree with you jose
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:29 pm
The bottom line is that people casted their votes on what is important to them (morals and Ideals). Whether or not you believe gay marrige is right or wrong, the votes are in. The majority of Californians think that marrige should be between a man and a woman. If you disagree with this next time be more active in getting your morals/ideals across and the next result might be different. Saying that those who voted for prop 8 are bigots is flat out slander. How can a person voting for what they believe is right for them (and please dont counter with “well Hitler thought waht he was doing was right” or any others of the like)as bigitry. Unfortunatley for homosexuals this country was founded upon Christain morals and a large population obviously still agrees with our founding fathers principles. In every election there are hotly contested issues, but dont allow your passion overshadow your better judgement when posting comments. Name calling and finger pointing wont change what has passed, only your future efforts will.
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:34 pm
Gay marriage has been legal for the last six months, or so, but only about 1% of the gay population have taken advantage of it. Interesting.
I don’t know about the requirement to “teaching gay marriage in schools” is valid or not. However, it’s a fact that marriage IS TAUGHT (whether the teacher is forced to or not) in schools, and parents should keep the right to teach thier children what they want.
Also, if gay marriage is forced upon society, it opens the doors for priests, rabbi’s, and bishops to be sued for refusing to marry gay couples. Fertilization doctors (who’s religious beliefs conflict with gay marriage) could be sued if they refutse to impregnate lesbian couples.
These last two reasons alone are why I voted Yes on 8.
I personally don’t agree with gay marriage, and I hope this proposition passes because I’m afraid of what will happen if it doesn’t. I don’t want my church to be attacked for having different beliefs. It cannot be denied that to a lot of people, being gay is a sin. Whether YOU believe it or not, SOME PEOPLE DO!!! They should not be attacked for that.
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:37 pm
I traveled to California with my partner of 5 years to get married on the beach in San Francisco 2 months ago. We own a house together and share all expenses. Marriage is simply a way for us to protect our assets. It also allows us to make health care decisions for our spouse when they are seriously sick. Those who voted against Prop 8: do you think it is right that if my partner was on his death bed, that I wouldn’t be allowed in the room because I am not “legally” family? These are the kinds of protections that we are looking for.
I have many friends and neighbors who are married and our marriage hasn’t affected their marriages at all.
If you want to use the Christian Bible to say that your point of view is better than mine, then let me ask you this: have you ever eaten shellfish (shrimp, etc.)? Because in the very same sentence where some claim the Bible condems homosexuality, it also condems people who eat shellfish. It’s in the same sentence and therefore deserves the same level of punishment. So if you have ever eaten shrimp, you have committed the same level sin as those of us who are gay. The Bible also advises how much you can sell your daughter into slavery for. Interesting how some things can be taken historically and others are not?
I grew up Catholic and I think that the Bible teaches some great things. I think it’s a great collection of stories that help people decide what is right and wrong. What I remember from going to 8 years of Catholic school and many more years of going to Church is that Jesus said, “Turn the other cheek.” and “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.” I think that is the most important lesson that the Bible teaches and it is unfortunate that so many Christians have lost their way and forgotten the Golden Rule.
Also, either you believe in Creation or you believe in Evolution. If you believe in Creation then that means that God created all, including me and my gay husband. If God did not create me, then how would I have come into being? Is it possible that God only created some and not others?
I believe that God will take me into heaven because I am a good person. I live a good life and I contribute to society in a positive way. I also do not impose my will on others and do not judge others as only God has the right to judge us. I feel sorry for those who believe otherwise.
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:43 pm
I AM A STRAIGHT 20 YEAR OLD WOMAN, BORN AND RAISED IN L.A., CURRENTLY LIVING IN LONDON. I KNOW COUNTLESS GAY PEOPLE AND I HAVE THEM IN MY FAMILY AND I CAN TELL YOU I’VE NEVER MET A GAY PERSON WHO WAS HATEFUL OR DISCRIMINATORY AGAINST ME FOR BEING STRAIGHT. I AM DISAPPOINTED IN ALL THE PEOPLE WHO VOTE YES ON 8. GAY PEOPLE ARE JUST LIKE EVERYONE ELSE, THEY WORK, THE STUDY, THEY HAVE PHDs AND THE HAVE FAMILIES. AND THEY ARE SOME OF THE MOST LOVING PEOPLE I’VE EVER MET! WHY CAN’T THEY GET MARRIED? BECAUSE OF RELIGION? I AM NOT RELIGIOUS I BELIEVE IN GOD AND I HAVE MY OWN PERSONAL RELATIONSHIP WITH HIM. AND I DONT THINK GOD IS A BIGOT. WHATEVER MEN WROTE THE BIBLE WERE BIGOTS. I BELIEVE THE BIBLE IS ALL FABLES, THERE ARE SOME GREAT LESSONS IN IT BUT FOR THE MOST PART IT IS MAN MADE. AND THERE HAS BEEN NO DEMONSTRATION OF RELIGIOUS MORALE ALL THROUGHOUT AMERICAN HISTORY, SO WHY ALL OF A SUDDEN ARE INTOLERANT PEOPLE TRYING TO CRY RELIGION?
ARE GAY PEOPLE THE ONES FUCKIN UP THE WORLD? SERIOUSLY?
THE FACT IS YOU DONT LIKE IT AND YOU’RE UNCOMFORTABLE WITH IT, AND YOU’RE USING RELIGION AS A SCAPEGOAT TO AVOID THE REAL ISSUE…YOU’RE A HATEFUL BIGOT. IF YOU’RE SO RELIGIOUS WHY THE FUCK CANT YOU JUST TURN THE OTHER CHEEK? BEING HATEFUL IS AGAINST RELIGION AS WELL. I WILL FIND IT OVERLY HILARIOUS IF 10 YEARS FROM NOW SOME OF YOU WHO VOTED YES ON 8 DISCOVER THAT YOU ARE GAY. YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO TAKE AWAY THE RIGHTS OF OTHERS. TO EACH HIS OWN, IT DOES NOT DIRECTLY AFFECT YOU SO GET OVER IT BIG BABIES! IT’S SO PATHETIC. I LOVE ALL THE GAY PEOPLE I KNOW AND I FEEL FOR THEM. IMAGINE HOW THEY MUST FEEL BEING INVITED TO WEDDINGS, KNOWING THEY HAVE NO RIGHT TO HAVE ONE. WHO THE FUCK ARE YOU TO SAY THEY CANT BE HAPPY AND LIVE THEIR LIVES TO THE FULLEST? THEY ARE HUMANS TOO. AND WHATEVER HAPPENED TO HUMAN RIGHTS? AND JUST LIKE YOU CANT HELP BEING HETEROSEXUAL, THEY CANT HELP BEING HOMOSEXUAL. I AM HOPEFUL BECAUSE OF OBAMA, BUT I STILL SEE THAT RACISM AND DISCRIMINATION ARE ALIVE AND WELL, ALONG WITH IGNORANCE, INTOLERANCE, BIGOTRY, FOOLISHNESS, SELFISHNESS AND THAT BULLSHIT “HOLIER THAN THOU” ATTITUDE THAT PEOPLE HAVE THE NERVE TO HAVE, WHEN THEY ARE THE MOST HATEFUL ONES AND THE BIGGEST THREAT TO HUMAN RIGHTS AND EQUALITY. IT IS TIME TO LET GO OF THAT MENTALITY BECAUSE IT IS NOT FAIR.
LIVE AND LET LIVE OR IT WILL COME BACK TO HAUNT YOU!
on November 5th, 2008 at 12:44 pm
To Chris…first of all I am a christian and I will tell you that there is nothing that can replace a love between a man and a woman. Chris how do you think you got here on earth. Not the stork. You can only adopt other children so long before you run out. I just want to keep the marriage between the woman and man sacred. By the way our school district does not send out letters stating they are going to teach about same sex. They have not done that yet. You know us old people want what is right for our children and the forseekable future. Religion is just a part of it. A major part of it. This Prop 8 already passed once and 4 Supreme court justices decided to take it in there own hands and over turn it. You call that FAIR. I certainly don’t especailly when the people spoke out the first time. You want to raise your kids on morals and values and try to do it the way you have been taught. 16 huh? You still have a long way to go to see the rest of this world we are so lucky to live here. the USA in which our Presidents before were all GODLY Men, This country is built by GOD and no other….MAKE SURE THAT YOU THANK GOD EVERY NIGHT THAT YOU ARE A LIVE AND EATING. ANd Above all quit taking things for granted. It could be worse, instead of persecuting the Christian religion why don’t you pick up a Bible and study the WORD.
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:00 pm
I feel like yesterday we won a huge victory. Barack Obama was voted the 44th President of the United States and now change and hope is inevitable. I won’t go into detail about politics, but last night, after the votes were counted, my excitement was followed by disappointment. With the notion of hope still fresh on our minds, the people of San Francisco were crushed after Proposition 8 drew closer and closer to passing. It was so hard to watch an African American man elected to office, as a symbol of equality for this nation, and moments later, equality was stripped from citizens who deserve it just as much as anyone else. I watched a straight woman, with a husband and children break down into tears. She was angry, and rightfully so. She told me that she just didn’t understand- how could some of the same people who fifty years ago couldn’t marry who they loved and have the same rights as other Americans because of the color of their skin, vote on a law that would deprive others of that same equality, and why? Because of the who they love? How is this any different than the civil rights movement? How can we, in the midst of all this hope and eagerness for change and justice and peace, continue to oppress our neighbors and friends and family? Who are they hurting? My prayers are with the men and women of California, who have fought so long and hard for the right to love, who were so close, and yet last night, the display of their commitment to each other and the families they have built became null. Last night, the Castro was filled with people rejoicing in the victory of Barack Obama, then crushed by the victory of those who continue to fight against equality. I pray they stay motivated and don’t give up the fight. I hope they keep the rings on their fingers and press on, not seeing this as a defeat, but just another obstacle. I pray they don’t give up hope and faith.
I felt so honored to be such a huge part of history yesterday. And I know the day will come when alters are crowded with people celebrating their love and freedom. I’ll be honored then too, no matter who I am with or if I have children or am married or single, to cast my vote and watch tolerance prevail over hate. I didn’t like California at first. But every day I learn more and more that a lot of the people here really carry something unique with them. People are involved. Pastors and ministers and men with wives and children support their neighbors without second thought, because they feel strongly that it is cruel and unjust to discriminate under the law for any reason. I was watching the polls with my dad last night. If you know my dad, you know he’s a pretty straight laced guy- very opinionated, sometimes even a little brash, and hardly ever serious without an undertone of sarcasm. We watched the numbers together and when Prop 8 ran across the bottom of the screen, with numbers leading in favor of “yes” I got a little confused. Thinking for a moment that a “yes” would grant equal rights to all I jumped off the couch and said “So we won? It passed”. In a very solemn tone he said “I think we were looking for a no”. In my haste to dial all my friends in Texas and proclaim the good news to everyone I forgot that “yes” would imply the ban and “no” would secure our rights as Americans. I got angry. I could feel hot tears rising to my eyes and I just wanted to look everyone who voted yes in the eye and ask them why? Why do you think same sex couples are going to ruin the sanctity of marriage? You want to know what’s ruining the sanctity of marriage? The divorce rate. The fact that so many people take this sacred union for granted- marrying once, twice, three, four times and getting divorced because they either rushed into it or they’re too fucking lazy to work it out. Because to them its no big deal. We can grant those heterosexual couples with the right to things like pre-nups, to make their divorce transitions more comfortable. That is ruining the sanctity of marriage. Reality television shows like “Who Wants to Marry a Millionaire” and “For Love or Money” advertise marriage as a tool for wealth and selfishness and greed and lust, while there are millions of people in California who want to marry for one reason alone- love. I wanted to say to them “Look you hateful pricks, MY DAD VOTED NO ON PROP 8!!!!”
What amazes me still, is that I know the very people who were affected by the hate and discrimination of proposition 8, will not rally and fight back with more hate. I know that God will furnish them with the peace that surpasses all understanding, and like the oppressed before them, they will overcome.
Stay Hopeful California.
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:02 pm
The idea that this is a new day and the old ways don’t apply anymore is ludicrous. “Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it.” So what we are saying is that we know better how to do things now and the people who built our democracy and built our nation were wrong. Someone said the kids these days don’t care about homosexuality. That statement is the problem. The kids don’t care, because they have been taught not to care by parents, governments and the morally bankrupt people of today’s society. Change is sometimes good. Advancement is sometimes good. Sacrificing your morals and values for the sake of progress is not progress, it is regression.
If you don’t have belief in something, then what do you have? This country was not founded on the separation of church and state. It was founded on the staunch belief in God, the separation came later. In my opinion the reason that homosexuals are so obsessed being able to get married is because they know what they are doing is wrong and they want to be justified. So, if everyone says it is okay, their actions become substantiated in their own lives and to the people around them. They can then be relieved of the guilt they feel for the immoral actions.
I agree with what starsarebent has said about hating the sinner not the sin. I am definitely not without sin myself and would not want people to hate me because of my bad decisions. I absolutely do not hate homosexuals. I also will not sacrifice my beliefs so that someone else can try to change black and white to a shade of gray. BTW, I have two mother-in-laws and I love them both very much and would do anything for them. However I do not agree with their lifestyle.
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:14 pm
This is amazing. I understand that those who support Prop 8 are acting out of fear and ignorance. That’s ok, but let’s work to avoid spreading this condition. If Prop 8 is not supported, which it certainly should not be, you do not lose any rights. This is coming from a married man, in a legal, traditional marriage. I wholeheartedly believe all human beings should be treated equally! That means you are allowed your personal beliefs and you may love who ever you want how ever you want. This has no effect on my traditional marriage.
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:15 pm
Prop 8 is unconstitutional. Equal rights for everybody!
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:21 pm
i voted yes on 8 and proud of it. equal rights for everyone including the terrests that destroyed our country?
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:31 pm
I am an ally, and I think anyone who is for prop 8 is ridiculous. Gay people not allowed to be married? So basically you don’t want gay people to have block parties, bbq’s, and fight with their spouse over finances like straight married people do?
Then you have some problems.
I can’t believe America can’t accept gays, lesbians, bisexuals, or transgenders. This is what people fought for in summer of 69 at Stonewall. It’s not fair they dont get the same rights.
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:31 pm
Some of you,
like “D”
are so twisted I feel like helping to pay for your education. You are really sad and unfortunate.
I hear you say, “No one is tryingto hate anyone that is gay,” and I understand that you don’t need to try, for you it just comes naturally.
Enjoy your next book-burning, KKK meeting, or wherever it is you’re off to. Let me know if you want to grow into a productive human being and I’ll chip in!
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:32 pm
To Jen,
Are you really comparing homosexuals to *terrorists*? I’m curious as to what makes you think that way. Care to expand?
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:40 pm
the crusades are over. long gone are the days when the christians invaded every free nation trying desperately to force the bible and its beliefs down everyones throat. the fight against gay marriage is a christian fight. im not christian. last time i checked this was america. and in america we have freedom of religion. just because christians believe something, doesnt mean the rest of us have to follow it. and if this country was founded on christianity and its values, then how does rape, murder, thieft, kidnaping, and slavery fall into christian values? thats what this country was founded on when christians stole it and its people instead of sharing it. every time the christian agenda is affraid of a culture or people or belief, they just kill everyone. i read the bible twice, and me and jesus couldnt find permission for that anywhere.
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:43 pm
Those who are thinking that support of Proposition 8 comes from people of religious faith against those who have no religious committment forget what religion is: it is the binding of oneself to one’s ultimate. For some it is their own “heart”, their passions; their temple is perhaps the movie houses celebrating sexual freedom; their source of hope for change is man; their offerings go for indulging in pleasure; and their method of doing missions for their god is ultra-liberal politics. This can be a fundamentalism of its own and sometimes exhibits more intolerance than what some suppose is found in all fundamentalism.
I would hope that those who vote for Proposition 8 do so for some of the following reasons:
1. Homosexual behavior and marriage is a form of suicide: if every marriage were of this kind, the nation
would eventually disappear from lack of children. The state has a duty to preserve and promote life.
2. Homosexual behavior and marriage is an unnecessary expense to the state: the average life span of the
homosexual male is 41, far below the 73 to 75 of the average male in the USA. The American Public
Health Association reports that more than 3-4ths of all homosexuals acquire a sexually transmitted
disease at least once in their life time. Now since the state takes measures to reduce hospital bills and
Medicare bills by penalizing those who don’t wear seat belts, and since we imprison those who ruin
their own lives and others lives when taking hard drugs , is there any logic to the state promoting or
honoring homosexual behavior which harms the people doing it, and costs those around them physical
and mental agony?
3. Homosexuality is contrary to nature: One of my doctor friends recently said that the act of inserting
the agent of generation into the place of feces elimination is very dangerous because of all the bacteria
there, and because the agent of generation is so easily infected. Most people have a natural aversion
to even discussing such a distorted act. Why would the state want to promote such unnatural activity,
by giving it special legal support?
4. “Unnatural activity?” Who has a right to say what is contrary to nature in our days of postmodern
philosophy and relativism? Well, who has a right to say how to keep a car in “good health”? Its
designer and maker, of course, who gives the owner a manual concerning oil change, tire pressure, etc.
So with the human body and marriage: God, the designer and maker of sex and marriage, revealed its
proper use in his manual the Bible. It is not homophobia but theophobia (the fear of God) which leads
me to point out that God “created them male and female”, & “he shall cleave unto his wife”. God
created Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve. (Genesis 1 and 2). God loved this plan so much that he
calls homosexual behavior an abomination in Leviticus 18:22 and warns that no homosexual will enter
heaven unless they repent (I Corinthians 6:9).
5. In the record of man’s history, we learn that God was pleased with governments that fought against
homosexual behavior. God said of one such government that its king did that which was “right in the
sight of the Lord.” And in the very next verse we are told what deeds this king did which were right,
the FIRST of which was he “put away the homosexuals from the land.” I Kings 15:11,12. Of course
we are no longer a theocratic state as was Israel, but God has not changed in his view of the beauty and
good of heterosexual marriage, nor in his consideration of homosexual activity as against nature and a
perversion: see post-theocratic times in Romans 1: 26, 27 where God talks of this act as “degrading
passion” and “unnatural”.
6. But some still insist that homosexual behavior is “natural”, because some are born with a genetic pre-
disposition for it. Witness, they say, the research of Simon Levee and Dean Haymore. Well, the
research of Dean Haymore is open to question, since he was a homosexual activist. Moreover a
colleague of Haymore (as exposed in the Chicago Tribune) accused him of deliberately excluding data
which did not support his thesis. Dr. Evan Ballaban of the Neurosciences Institute in San Diego
concurs that Haymore’s research was seriously flawed by its methods and its basic assumptions. In a
recent Wall Street Journal article, 5 secular psychologists wrote that up to 50% of homosexuals who
seek treatment experience significant improvement, and I know people who have been completely
cured of this perverse desire, are married in a heterosexual way, and have children.
For all these reasons, the state should not listen to 2% of its population, its wealthy
gay men whose wealth and willingness to distort the truth give them such seeming power.
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:50 pm
i am a christian and a straight man.
obviously there have been more wars and killing in the name of religion than anything else. the majority of christians, and christian leaders in particular, seem to have no trouble setting aside the teachings of christ when it suits their personal interests.
i still believe in christ and his teachings and i am sure he would oppose prop 8. he would find its being discussed at all deeply saddening, but would be patient and loving toward those people that fear freedom for all.
you cannot be a true christian and justify war. that is impossible, because christ taught us better than that.
you cannot be a christian and deny gay people the right to marry. christ taught us better than that.
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:51 pm
Geez, I can’t believe the amount of absurdity proponents of Prop 8 are able to generate to validate their way of rationalizing this issue. The only ‘good’ thing to come out of a final outcome that passes Prop 8, is that now perhaps it will finally be taken to the Supreme Court (of the US, not Calif), where it will most assuredly be overturned, and non-discrimination of marriage will become a national change, as was the case of Roe vs. Wade, and thus relieving any and all ’state-by-state’ decision making, at least in my opinion.
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:54 pm
net time drug addicts would also be fighting for equal rights.. marriage should and would be between one man and one woman
on November 5th, 2008 at 1:59 pm
Are you trying to spell, “terrorist,” Jen?
You poor ignorant thing.
Maybe I can chip in for your tuition too.
I can forgive you for voting for Prop 8, you know not what you do.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:03 pm
you cant MAKE everyone believe what you believe. it is ok if you are religious or athiest or spiritual or taoist for that matter. if you think gay marriage is a sin or against your beliefs or principles, then dont get gay married. you have that right. thats the beuty of this country. if you dont shop on sunday because you are latter day saint, that is your right. noone is MAKING you go to the store. what you dont have is the right to close all the stores because you felt in your heart that the mormon teachings were right. how can you tell a catholic person they can no longer shop on sunday? or a jewish person they HAVE to celebrate christmas? or a gay person they cant get married.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:04 pm
Thank you Clem for proving my point so quickly and eloquently…drug addicts fight for equal rights… And which rights are they now being deprived of?? I believe they can marry already, and even bring drug addicted children into the world. What else do you think they are lacking?
And the absurdity continues. Thanks again Clem.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:05 pm
The Only reason it passed is because statically more conservatives vote than liberals. I honesty think if everyone really voted it would have ruled in favor of no. The fact this even was brought to a vote breaks my heart its every ones right to fall in love and have marriage laws protect and strengthen their marriage, I hope we get a chance again in four years to vote on this. My Boyfriend and I would love to see his sister able to share the same god given right to love and marry just as we can, its more than a label its laws that protect and help a married couple, if one dies, if one gets hurt there are so many things than just the label!
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:10 pm
Interesting things to think about:
I appreciate the blessing and prayers that my “Straight” friends offer to me, like wise I offer to them every day. My friends and family as it grows every day, I pray that their 1st or 17th newborn child does not end up “gay”. What I find more fascinating is the dialogue between gay and straight individuals succumbing to issues on morality and values, and sinfulness. This whole issue about equality with or without a church has a much bigger picture than we in California will ever be able to come to imagine, or so I hope it does change. I am sure some where there is a blog that is comparing the new president elect, a black man, to those before him, all white men, and just how morally corrupt our country has become. If it isnt the color of our skin, it is the difference of our religious beliefs, or preference to whom we “choose” to love, these issues will always be a key to making a “Change”! Change is scary for anyone, gay or straight, sinful or sin free. Today I celebrate with my openly gay black friend who just by the color of his skin kept saying I never thought I would live to see this day. I tell him “you did” and others will as well! As long as the sanctitiy of marriage is upheld and the men and women continue to procreate, creating thousands of beautiful babies who will grow up to be straight or gay, no matter what color they are, or what religiion they grow into, will also be more “accepting” and more understanding, with out the cause to answer the question, “what makes you like you are? How can you be that way?”
Finally, what I am excited, most is the narrow margin of this prop 8 passing. For those of you who celebrate the passing, by all means go ahead and celebrate today, come tomorrow when this issue comes again, the idea of change is inevitable and most likely going to happen just as quickly as the first black man became my President! I am so proud of that! I still love my straight and gay friends! God bless us all!
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:11 pm
maybe in four years we will be able to us the ’straight’ bathroom and drink out of the ’straight’ water fountain.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:12 pm
Atheist heterosexuals can get married.
Would yes on 8 supporters also vote yes on a constitutional ammendment banning atheists from marrying? I mean, obviously their marriages are not sacred. In fact, they choose to have a non-sacred marriage. Obviously you cannot make this law in the US because it is explicitly unconstitutional.
However, pretend we were in a different country, where more power was given to voters than the constitution. Would you support a ban on atheist marriages because they are not sacred?
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:15 pm
You people just don’t get it. Throughout history every civilization who has ok’d an alternate perverted lifestyle, the civilization crumbled shortly after that.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:15 pm
TO JEN-
You are seriously ignorant comparing marriage to terror, terrorist should be imprisoned for trying to hurt our American people, for oppressing their own people. Gays should not since they are only trying to love, how is falling in love a bad thing.. .How does it harm your marriage? If I worship Satan I can get married , I would think that is far worse if I am a terrorist I can get married, but that’s ok. These are peoples personal choices they have nothing to do with you or ur marriage live and let love homies this is completely absord
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:24 pm
to RK-
like catholic priests? or polygamists? or any of the ‘religions’ that preach one thing and do another behind closed doors?
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:25 pm
Thank you, RK
for that ideal depiction of fear and ignorance
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:29 pm
they just keep putting thier foot in thier mouth dont they?
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:29 pm
Just commenting on the facts of history. The truth hurts!!!
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:30 pm
You people arguing for prop 8 are a sad, sad bunch of people. I can’t believe you exist this day in age… listening to you is very disheartening.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:34 pm
the facts of history are that christians murdered and raped thier way through history. get a book.
gay people can get married legally in many countries. and have been able to do so for a very long time.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:34 pm
Sounds like you could use some tutoring, RK.
Poor thing. I’m happy to oblige.
That rattling sound must be your tiny brain up there.
It’s ok, we’ll work on it.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:35 pm
Homosexuality is a perversion just like rape,incest & pedifials, it’s a perverted way of life. Christian values are a way of life but yet you can’t teach that in schools it’s about Love isn’t it. Thank God Ca. still has values. Why don’t we just let people molest little kids, oops that is wrong isn’t it. but it’s the same perversion as homosexuality period.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:42 pm
that wins the uneducated statement of the day! what christian values? the ones that founded this country? like rape, murder, thieft, abuse? or the ones the priests use on little boys? when an adult molests a child of the same sex, it doesnt make them gay, stupid. its a phsycological control issue.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:43 pm
and “jd” is saying nothing.
It’s clear that the problem is ignorance and the cure must be education.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:46 pm
what can you say to the truth?
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:47 pm
Don’t respond to the trolls people. We’re better than them.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:48 pm
Congradulations California for standing up for decency! Being gay is a sexual perversion. Just because so many people consider being gay as their “normal behavior” does not make it right. Immorality in whatever form, and accepted by whatever group, is wrong. Some day, maybe soon, we will understand this. That will certainly be a great and terrible day.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:49 pm
Ya Griffin, like the education you force on our children in kindergarten , 1st grade etc. perversion. you people have no clue. You call us names but you people are the ones who are intolerate and very hatefull. You try to take over what we consider sacred and Holy. You are very confused.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:52 pm
thier lack of intelect is the best support FOR same sex marriage.
i wonder why they’re so interrested in our sexualality in the first place. . . . .
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:55 pm
you are trying to take over what I consider sacred and holy. how is that ok?
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:57 pm
we arent taking anything from you. its the other way around.
on November 5th, 2008 at 2:59 pm
You are mis-informed. Sorry for your ignorance. Should I write more slowly?
on November 5th, 2008 at 3:11 pm
I’m a straight female. I have a lot of friends that are part of the Queer community. Actually, 2 of them just got married over the weekend. Even if I never met any of them, I’d still vote No. People should have the right to marry the person they love. There’s also another really good argument.
Let’s say I was “married” to a woman. Not legally, since there’s a ban on gay marriage… One day, I’m crossing the street and some drunk driver runs a red light and hits me. I’m unconscious and bleeding, the paramedics take the to the hospital, but the doctors can’t do anything until a family member or spouse signs the forms. My ‘wife” wouldn’t be recognized as my spouse. None of my family members can get to me in time and I die.
There wouldn’t be a problem if I was married to a man.
Does that seem fair to you???
on November 5th, 2008 at 3:19 pm
Okay; so I hear all the screaming about rights and religion and feelings and love.
Marriage is more than a regious thing. It is more than a couple living together in love. The purpose of a man and a woman marrying in a long term, (hopefully for life) relationship is to bind the couple together so they have a safe and loving home where they can raise children. We can claim rights and hatred and adopt and even get surgeries, but biology requires that a man and woman get together and both, together raise healthy children and create the future.
on November 5th, 2008 at 3:20 pm
No on Prop 8 proponents voted on what they believe is right. We did the same when we voted yes. What I don’t get is why we are branded as intolerant when we vote for what we believe. YOU are equally as guilty of intolerance.
I do discriminate…I would not hire a registered sex offender to babysit my 4 year old daughter. Is that also being intolerant and discriminating?
on November 5th, 2008 at 3:23 pm
I have not read many of the comments above. I would just like to speak a moment about the issue of public schools and the teaching of sexual preference in them.
I attend a private university in a different state now, but every single year of my public education was spent in a conservative town in California. My public high school had top test scores in the region, and I was very fortunate to attend there.
Even though most of the students and their parents were conservative, the teachers were extremely liberal, and they were extremely outspoken about their personal views on sexual preference and on other personal values. They spouted their beliefs as fact, and did not tolerate any discussion on the matter. If there were students in the class who believed differently, they were not allowed to speak openly about those beliefs.
My experience from public school in California was very negative because the teachers were not open-minded to their students’ beliefs. Even though there ARE laws that give students the option to opt out of the health/sex education, it is extremely difficult to do so - not on a legal matter, but a social one. For example, I was in an Advanced Placement English Literature class my junior year, and my teacher wanted us to read a book that is widely known to be an extremely controversial book because of the way it portrays sex and marriage. Even though the teacher said we could opt out of reading the book, the negative consequences of not reading the book were very high, both academically and socially. The teacher basically said, “Now, you can opt out of reading this book if you want, but I would highly recommend against it. This is the book that we will be discussing in class for the next three weeks, and 50% of the final will be based on this book. Of course, you could read another book and go to the library during class the next 3 weeks, and I will give a different final to you - but you will have to read the book on your own. Ok, so who doesn’t want to read this book? Raise your hand.”
From my experiences (and there were many other experiences just like this), teachers are not flexible. Even if the teacher had said, “If you want to read the other book, discuss it privately with me after class,” it would be obvious to all students when a particular student goes to the library for 3 weeks. Students who opted out were teased and gossiped about, and this intolerance was and still is socially acceptable according to many. Even though the law is supposed to protect these students from learning something they do not believe, it does nothing to protect these students from being social harassed. The law protects gays and lesbians from this form of social harassment, but it does nothing to protect the students who opt out of learning what they don’t personally believe.
Teachers give the second option because the law tells them to, but that it is. I knew many parents who took their kids out of this high school to be home schooled because teachers taught things as absolute truth when they were actually based on personal beliefs. Teachers should teach according to what their degree taught them, not their own personal agendas.
Every single person has personal beliefs, and whether they believe they got these beliefs from a divine authority or not does not matter. All of our beliefs come from somewhere - religious influence, science, logical reasoning, parents, teachers, history, and even from governmental influence. Who is to say whether one authority is more correct than the other? No human on earth has the authority to dictate which is more correct than the other; thus, it is left to the individual to decide and make decisions in accordance to what they believe.
Every person should be allowed to rationally explain what they believe, without receiving a label or a social stimga against them. I cringe every time I hear someone using the word “gay” as an adjective to mean “lame” or “weird” just as I cringe when someone calls someone else a “bigot” or a “hater.” Every person has the right to believe what they want in the classroom setting without being negatively labeled or socially shunned.
Public schools should be a place where students can learn and grow. This should take place in an environment where it is NOT socially/politically acceptable to call people either “fag” or “old-fashioned bigot.” Personal beliefs should not be discussed on school campuses by teachers at all, because teachers are the figures of authority, so when they say their personal beliefs it is like they are saying it as 100% fact. If there are discussions in schools on these issues as dictated by necessity of what the course teaches (i.e. US History classes, debate teams, etc), name-calling should not be allowed on either side. Credible sources and statistics should be used to support why a person wants to act a certain way, NOT random statistics heard on the news. In the social science world, the processes of conducting research is something that is highly scrutinized, and the best research is unbiased research that is replicated over many years of research. Proponents of gay marriage cannot use statistics yet to support their belief that children raised in a gay or lesbian home are just as happy as children raised in heterosexual homes, because long-term effects are not taken into account. It will take a whole generation to finally have credible statistics in that regard. Even though science is not always the most correct authority, it is the most widely accepted because it tries to remove personal biases from research (and this bias applies to both sides of the argument).
I said earlier that no person has the right to say which type of authority is more correct than another. Since conflicts of interest naturally arise over this (I mean, opponents and proponents of gay marriage can’t both have their own way), we have the government institution to help resolve those conflicts. Voting is a way for people to express their opinions, and, in our government, the majority usually dictates how the government responds. The government should not dictate what is right according to marriage, and neither should the media. Individual people should decide how to respond to the conflict that arises over these two separate beliefs - opposing gay marriage and accepting it. In this election, the majority decided to oppose it. In the next election, the people may vote to accept it.
Either way the majority decides, please do not bring personal attacks into this issue. Next election, take time to study the issues without personal bias. Rationally think over the different sides of the issue, and then come to a conclusion. People will do this and come to different conclusions, and that is perfectly acceptable. People have that right to believe differently. There have been hate and intolerance on both sides of this debate, and that has got to end.
Thank you for your time.
on November 5th, 2008 at 3:28 pm
Jesus loves gay people enough to want them to change from their perverted debased mind.
Romans